The irony of it all - open carry picnics.

Thanks for a great story. It is time we dispel myths and falsehoods about firearms in Wisconsin. People who support open and concealed carry of firearms can provide factual evidence of crime decreasing when law abiding citizens are armed. Those against firearms, and allowing citizens to possess and carry them, use knee-jerk terms like "gunslingers", "Old West", "shootouts", etc. Since AG Van Hollen issued a memo clarifying what was already a right - open carrry, has there been any incidents of shootings, disorderly conduct, or "brandishing"? Of course not. When Governor "wear it on your hip" Doyle is defeated in 2010, if he actually runs, we will have a Republican governor who will sign concealed carry legislation. Again there will be the same anti-gun hysteria that will again be proven to be mere folly.

I live in Tennessee where we have carry permits available to all law abiding citizens. One must pass a state and federal background check, take an 8 hour state certified safety course, then pay the state a permit fee.
Tennessee enacted the carry permits in 1994, there has been no "Old West Shootouts" to the dismay of the many liberals who hate the Second Amendment.
Laws have been recently changed as to where a permit holder can carry a loaded rifle or shotgun in their vehicle and carry a handgun in a restaurant which serves alcohol.
Keep in mind that the citizens who go through background checks, take safety classes, and obtain carry permits through the Department of Safety are LAW ABIDING, TAX PAYING CITIZENS.
Criminals don't do any of this, they never had and never will.
The times are changing where citizens will not tolerate being victims of guntoting criminals.

The real irony is in the fact that now that you can open carry legally, no one has the balls to do so! Well, that is, outside of open carry events. It doesn't take any more courage to strap on a sidearm while attending an open carry picnic then it does to don a sheet while attending a Klan picnic...when was the last time you heard of violence erupting at a Klan picnic? Considering that you folks seem to be living in constant fear, shouldn't you practice open carry wherever you go? Why not strap that sucker on when attending church? Is it because killers only target liberal churches?

I'm all for open-carry. I have no problem with the concept, even though it will be less harder to identify who is carrying guns illegally since we will become less sensitized to seeing heat in public.

I just don't think a criminal is going to care so much if other people are packing. Criminals don't give a damn. It's why they are criminals in the first place.

Sorry, jmark, I miss your logic, if there is any.
Open carry events - where people are exercising their right to bear arms - are a tad different than a KKK rally, ya think?

And I don't think many conservatives lived in constant fear until Obama was elected President. He's a one-man wrecking machine when it comes to America and American values.

Killers only target liberal churches? Say what? Where do you get your material from? I'd have to say nut jobs target churches, schools, and/or other establishments, wouldn't you? People who are crazy rarely differentiate among one's political beliefs.

Thanks for the comment, jmark. I expected it and you didn't let me down!

The right to bear arms is a Constitutional right, and therefore a basic American right...formally so, since it is an Amendment to the Constitution, and has been re-affirmed by the SCOTUS. That said, most police will tell you they will exercise their right to stop anyone walking around with a gun on their hip and ask them why they are doing so. If they can produce a bonafide license, and have no criminal record, they can go on their merry way. That said, people walking around with weapons all the time seems, well, a little too Quentin Tarentino for my tastes. C'est l'Vie...

And the point of walking around with a loaded weapon is what? I'm reminded of Bill Engvall's famous line - "Here's your sign!!!"

Amy - In Jmarks defense:

"A four-page letter found in Jim D. Adkisson's small SUV indicated he intentionally targeted the Tennessee Valley Unitarian Universalist Church because, the police chief said, "he hated the liberal movement" and was upset with "liberals in general as well as gays."

URL: http://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory?id=5460721

Here's a case where a nutcase murded people for their poltics.

LiberalHammer: I almost mentioned Jim Adkisson in my own comment, just to take the wind out of jmarks sails. Adkisson has been mentioned ad nauseam as one example of a nut case shooting up a church and having an anti-lib agenda. Now libs seem to love using this guy as an example. An example of what? Out of the hundreds of thousands of killings this country sees, you and jmark find one case of a very unstable person targeting a liberal church? I fail to see the point, other than jmark wanted to get that jab in there to make it appear as though anyone who supports gun rights may go after liberal churches to shoot 'em up? That simply isn't true. The Jim Adkisson example is totally irrelevant to anything in my post.

referee33: Actually, the point of the open carry picnics and open carry in general is a roundabout way to force Governor Doyle's hand to allow for concealed carry. Remember how anti-gun, anti-2nd amendment, Doyle and the Dems are? Doyle has vetoed concealed carry every time it has been presented to him. Wisconsin is only one of two states that do not allow concealed carrying of weapons. Many feel that by walking around openly with guns, they may force the Governor's hand to abide by the Constitution.

Amy: Thank you for the explanation. But I still don't understand the need to carry a weapon around, openly or concealed, in the first place. If it is supposed to be a deterrent to crime, I would think that open carry would be more desirable. Even though it may present an invitation for someone to attempt to steal it. If the weapon is being concealed, what good is it as a deterrent? And how effectively could it be brought into use if needed, if it's in a purse or under a coat?

I don't know what kkk meat and great you go to jmark,
but of the last three I saw 2e wer violently attacked by the
naacp types while PEACEFULLY organizing with permits,
and obeying the law. Guess they should start OC'ing
to protect themselves from the government sponsored
racist groups. the one rally that OC'd shutguns had no
violence against them. Yelling from a greater distance
away, but otherwise peaceful.

referee33, I am glad you live and work in a safe place
that doesn't allow criminals. But unfortunately most of
us must confront the governments refusal to lock up
violent criminals in our homes, and the streets where we live. I haven't had to "draw down" on a bad guy yet, but
will live with the wear and tear on my belts rather than
not carrying and need to get my head sewn back on.

But most importantly, you do not arm yourself to hunt,
the constitution was written to make sure you could rise up
and stop an oppressive government. You know the type,
they take your money to fund idiotic liberal organizations,
make it a crime to own a safe car, demand you strip if you
want to travel by air while exempting themselves.
The very idea that the gov. wants you to only use a .22
against their tanks is the worst of all. That is all you need according to them to stop a tyrant with aircraft and artillery.

No the biggest statement by OC'ing is sorry BHO there is
still a constitution powers zone that extends for a 250 yard
radius from my hip.
That I can stop a bad guy is just a plus.

referee33: I think that by allowing concealed carry, many criminals would indeed think twice before deciding to rob, rape, or otherwise harm someone. Law-abiding citizens would no longer be easy targets, since criminals wouldn't know if their intended victim did or didn't have a gun - a method to defend and protect themselves. Among the 48 states that allow concealed carry, none has turned into a "wild west." And many find crime rates go down! Just look up concealed carry/crime rates on the internet and check it out.

slackwarerobert: The general population is about as comfortable with open carry as they are with people wearing white sheets in public.

I have yet to see anyone open carry. We have the right to bear arms, yet it seems very few if any are exercising that right. Why aren't the right to carry advocates packing heat? The reason these big tough Clint Eastwood types don't carry is because they're fearful of the public's reaction. Ironic.

jmark: J.B. Van Hollen only recently ruled that open carry was perfectly legal. Prior to Van Hollen's ruling, people were actually still subject to being arrested for carrying a weapon out in the open. After numerous individuals and locations petitioned Van Hollen to rule on the legality of open carry, he did - towards the end of April 2009. Since that time, people should NOT be arrested for carrying guns out in the open. Perhaps that is why you do not see many people as of yet toting guns in public - because the Attorney General's announcement came about just a few weeks ago?

15 total comments (excluding this one). 5 of which are Hemmers, with one counted twice aimed at two posters. 1 post by me (excluding this one). 10 by others -- and not all necessarily directed at Hemmer.

Amy to this point accounts for 1/3 of the total posts.

Seems like she is commenting far too much on her blogs if you ask me.

In light of the ever increasing lawlessness resulting from the election of Obama, what's preventing you from strapping on your 357 mag? Aren't you afraid of being robbed, raped, or otherwise harmed when going out? Or aren't you one of the many conservatives who live in constant fear?

Amy: There is a logic to your argument that is acceptable. I'm not totally convinced that it (concealed carry) will be effective but your reasoning makes sense. I would lean more toward open carry, but that is strictly my preference.
@slackwarerobert: I wonder how you are able to get any beneficial rest at night, what with having to patrol the perimeter of your compound to protect your family from the threat of roaming criminal gangs. Do you have enough fuel to power the auxiliary generators to maintain the searchlights and electric fence that protects your home in case the power goes out? Got enough food to survive after the big bang coming from N.Korea, Iran, the visitors to area 51? "Draw down" on the bad guys. How many Dirty Harry movies a day do you watch? "Make it a crime to own a safe car" What the hell are you talking about? "Demand you strip if you want to travel by air" You are so out of touch with reality, I'll pay for your drug test just to find out what you're on!

Jmar, go to opencarry.org and you will see people are indeed open carrying all over the state. You seem to think that people that want to arm themselves "live in constant fear". Nothing could be further from the truth. We have smoke detectors not because we live in constant fear of a fire, we have them in the remote case of a fire. We where seat belts not because we live in constant fear of an accident but do so just in case of an accident. It is the same thing with guns. We do not carry them because we live in constant fear of trying to make us a victim of a crime, we do so just in case somebody tries to. Not everybody has a smoke detector, not everybody wears a sear belt and not everybody carrys a firearm but over time, more will. Hope this clears it up for you.

moparman1: Excellent points. You may have silenced jmark with your common sense approach and observations. It will be interesting to see if he can come up with a logical response.

@moparman1: I think there is more to your desire to open carry than you admit. If the need to carry is likened to a smoke detector and a seat belt, why are you not advocating and pushing for the use of tasers and all pepper sprays in WI? The use of lethal force is OK but non-lethal force to accomplish the same purpose is not? What a mixed up world we live in!

referee33: moparman1 got the point here. We talk about deadly force here, not toys.

If you think guns are dangerous and can kill human beings. You need to think about FIRE, VEHICLE ACCIDENTS. A smoke detector, and a seat belt which can save your life.

Now think about a GUN that can also do the same to save your life. If guns are so bad, why do police carry them. Why can cops just do fists fights? We don't want to be victims, but survivors.

If you don't like weapons, don't buy'em or use them, just wait for the cop to show up at your door steps.

I hope this will answer your thoughts.

My Name: It helps me understand where you re coming from. Thanks. I would suggest not using the smoke detector analogy any more. A smoke detector just warns and has no deterrent capabilities. You should consider using the sprinkler system as an analogy instead. It can not only warn but can also kill the fire as well. I have weapons, I just don't see the need to advertise the fact.

@All: Amy is liar. LIAR. She just stated on my brothers blog: "For getting kicked off of livinglakecountry.com" again, after I fully refuted her smear and accusations that I did not get kicked off LLC. Here is the timeline, once again to expose Amy as LIAR.

1) Thursday May 27th, I begin to remove posts at LLC
2) Friday May 28th. Morning, I finish removing the rest of my posts from LLC.
3) May 29th: Erin Mellone emails me and asks me what happened to my blog. I inform her that I removed my content.
4) May 31st: Tiller is murdered in cold blood. I post "f you pro-life hypocrites" on blogspot. Not LLC. NOT LLC - you got that?
5) June 2nd: Chris OConner emails Amy (or the other way around) wondering if the post "f you pro-life hypocrites" on blogspot -- alleging I was kicked off of LLC blogs for it.
6) June 3rd: Amy states: Rumor has it that MC Pickard got the boot due to a very naughty blog he tried to post... (Wednesday Jun 03, 2009 7:13 AM )

If you can read a calender and understand context. I had already removed my content and ended my publishing at LLC. Got that? But for some reason, you Amy want the rest of us to believe I returned to publish one post that would not get through the censoring software in the first place? Well?

7) June 3rd: I post telling Amy to stop her lies immediately. (Wednesday Jun 03, 2009 11:00 AM)

Amy you are LIAR. A filthy liar that deserves the abuse I send your way.