Humane or Cost-Effective?
My wife recently suffered a very serious stroke, She spent two weeks in the hospital and is now in a nursing home. I share this personal information as background for some observations on the current health care debate.
There is ongoing an intense artillery duel of words, claims, accusations, statistics and anecdotes from both sides of the debate over national health care. (Come on, you know that's what it's really about.) One side claims that care will be rationed, especially for the elderly. The other side vehemently denies this. This is in fact the case in the UK and, to a lesser extent, in Canada, an inevitable result as costs spiral upward and politicians and bureaucrats are caught between the rock-and-hard-place of confiscatory taxation versus service.
This rationing is quite subtle and not absolute. There is much debate, but expensive life-extending medical procedures for folks over 60 are frequently withheld or delayed. The testimonials from Britons happy with their health care are overwhelmingly from younger folks, as witnessed by the interviews in Michael Moore's movie Sicko.
I witnessed the crux of the problem during this past two weeks. The great majority of folks in beds that I saw were elderly. No question that our bodies deteriorate as we age--all of us. The assertion that most of the health care costs in the U.S. are incurred by old folks is, as far as I can see, completely valid. This is a major factor in the high cost of medical care and insurance. Other countries with nationalized health care employ--often subtly--policies that reduce these costs, hence the claim that "their" health care is less expensive. One structural problem is that doctors (in the U.K.) are salaried and work a normal work day with little incentive to put forth extra effort.
There is no magic formula regarding cost. Today's medical technology is expensive. The only way to substantially reduce the cost is to reduce expensive procedures like transplants. (No, the insurance companies are not staffed by robber barons! Their rates are based on payout statistics.) Some savings are achievable by eliminating duplication in facilities and drugs, which should be done--regrettably--via government intervention. I'm afraid that would result in fairly modest savings when compared to organ transplants and joint replacements.
Dr. Ezekial Emanuel, health policy advisor to President Obama, likely czar of any "government option" and brother of Chief of Staff Rahm Emanuel, has repeatedly and publicly advocated rationing of health care dollars based on fiscal principles. He has suggested restricting expensive health care procedures for the elderly and the very young! His reasoning is that society has not yet invested much in the young so not much is lost by their departure. Conversely, the elderly have little or nothing more to contribute to society, so they too are expendable. Best to invest scarce health care dollars in the lucky folks in the middle who are worth more to society, i.e. will provide a ROI (Return on Investment).
I'm sure Dr. Emanuel also opposes dripping water on the faces of terrorists to elicit information as constituting inhumane torture. (Liberals seem to have little difficulty with inconsistencies.)
The decision regarding national health care is straightforward, if not easy. Either ROI or humane; we really can't have it both ways. (By the way, "single-payer" Medicare already does this to some extent by tightly limiting rehabilitation coverage following a stroke. I know this first hand. Those pesky old folks again.) I guess it's our "Hobson's Choice."
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24 Comments
Tami Klink - Sep 03, 2009 11:28 PM
Have a great week!
referee33 - Sep 04, 2009 12:40 AM
lakeside liberterian - Sep 04, 2009 2:23 AM
However I do take issue with this opinion,"One structural problem is that doctors (in the U.K.) are salaried and work 9 to 5 with no incentive to put forth extra effort." I'm sure the dedicated DR will put forth effort, where as the US med school grad is working a dogged schedule to pay back his education.Which to you makes a more attentive caretaker?
Not knowing anyone personally in a"socialized medicine" country I cannot give any example on their care, but something needs to be done to fix our broken system. I'm sure for every bad example you can give on the slowness of care there , there is a citizen of our country dying( maybe very slowly) from having no insurance and therefor no care at all.
lake country progressive - Sep 04, 2009 6:54 AM
If you insist on taking this position, then you must also claim that health care is rationed everywhere. After all, there's a finite amount of resources anywhere you go, therefore nobody can get more resources than whats available.
So why not just admit you're spreading a bunch of baloney.
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"expensive life-extending medical procedures for folks over 60 are frequently withheld or delayed."
Here you speak truth. In the US, this occurs frequently.
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"The testimonials from Britons happy with their health care are overwhelmingly from younger folks"
I would expect you to understand that the older people get sicker more often and sick people generally are less happy about ANY health related matters. What's your point?
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"I witnessed the crux of the problem during this past two weeks."
And your solution appears to be that you want me to keep paying for your wife's care, but you don't want 19 year olds to be covered at all. Yes, I'm sure you don't want that to change and you "see" that the problem is that coverage might be extended past "your kind".
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"The only way to substantially reduce the cost is to reduce expensive procedures like transplants."
No it isn't. That's very ignorant of you. I would imagine that you believe the only way to deliver packages quicker is to provide the pony express with faster ponies too. Ever here of Jets? Cell phones were once too expensive for individuals to own. Now there cheap. Heck, space flight is becoming cheap enough for individuals to go to space. Transplants can become cheaper too.
lake country progressive - Sep 04, 2009 6:56 AM
I'm sure neanderthals like you love to torture. (Neocons have no problem acting inhumanely.)
lake country progressive - Sep 04, 2009 6:57 AM
That's exactly what republicans say too.
" He has suggested restricting expensive health care procedures for the elderly and the very young!"
The republicans say only for those with a job, but that excludes the elderly too, so there's no difference other than the elderly are already grandfathered in (no pun intended).
lakeside liberterian - Sep 04, 2009 8:28 AM
Jeff Blackwell - Sep 04, 2009 8:45 PM
So very sorry to hear about your wife. My thoughts are with you, her, and your family.
I have to say, though, that your perspective of our health care system is myopic. You and your wife are both eligible for Medicare, which I have to point out was fought tooth and nail by Republicans. As was Social Security. As was unemployment insurance. As were virtually every law that protects the health and safety of Americans.
If you did not have this nationalized health care system, which I have been paying into since it was established as law, do you know what this unfortunate (although not unpredictable) illness would be costing you, personally?
Please read my post on my conversations with British citizens about their national health care system. Nationalized health care is the only moral choice.
aneuhauser - Sep 04, 2009 11:04 PM
I have edited the post slightly to clarify some of my comments. It seems to me that just about every national health care system is in financial difficulty and searching for ways to cut costs.
My point is that you can't achieve major cost reduction without cutting back on expensive medical procedures. Eliminating insurance company profitability will just drive them out of business. You can't cut corners on an organ transplant procedure and it's not going to happen through "efficiencies". Direct cost controls have never worked for anything.
The only way to accomplish significant savings is to withold expensive procedures from some people and that gets into a selection process. Call it what you will.
On the other hand, my wife was incompetently misdiagnosed in the ER, resulting in significantly greater impairment. So, I guess I'm not the greatest fan of our medical care system at this point. Talk about conflicted.
Jeff Blackwell - Sep 04, 2009 11:14 PM
Get some rest. It's out of your hands.
aneuhauser - Sep 05, 2009 9:46 PM
Tami Klink - Sep 06, 2009 9:42 AM
Let us know if you need anything! Joan is very lucky to have you by her side.
ajohnson911 - Sep 06, 2009 12:42 PM
jhayett - Sep 07, 2009 8:30 AM
If I can help by sharing my fathers fight, please email me on the side. You know how to get a hold of me.
May God bless all of you.
Jeff Blackwell - Sep 17, 2009 10:34 PM
How is your wife doing?
How are you?
aneuhauser - Sep 18, 2009 11:16 PM
I'm transferring her to a specialty hospital in Waterford in hopes of better results. Up to my *** in lawyer stuff, since she's legally incompetent. The system does not make it easy, but I've got a good lawyer. I'm O.K., just a little tired. Thanks for your concern.
Tami Klink - Sep 23, 2009 4:58 PM
referee33 - Sep 23, 2009 7:19 PM
djklein - Sep 28, 2009 11:26 AM
But, why not work towards something better with health care? something that has the potential to not ration health care at all? Where all people can get what they need when they need it?
Best wishes and regards.
Tami Klink - Sep 28, 2009 6:03 PM
In the end, it's really not the U.S. public that matters. We were forgotten long ago. They all just figure out ways to make money off of those of us that actually work, pay taxes and follow the rules.
Really fair, huh?
Have a great week!