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February 2010

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referee33
Wednesday Nov 11, 2009 9:23 AM

I guess the slogan "we're fighting them over there, so we don't have to fight them in our streets" ends up in the same bin as "mission accomplished".

ajohnson911
Wednesday Nov 11, 2009 10:42 AM

yea, referee, that USED to be true but when you elect a liberal (weak on defense) that IS what you get--one more example of obama's failed administration. Bush=safe since 9-11-01 (about 8 years); obama=an attack by a terrorist in the first year (about 8 months). Keep up the great work Amy; referee, et al, keep up the deaf, dumb, blind monkey routine.

Christian Democrat
Wednesday Nov 11, 2009 11:25 AM

I still do not understand why a "terrorist" is only those that kill in the name of Islam? Why is it okay for a Christian to kill in the name of their religion (according to those on the Right), but not okay for anyone else?

Killing is killing - doesn't matter what god or God you worship - or if you worship none at all.

And ajohnson911 - it appears that Amy disproved your theory of "safe since 9/11" since she quoted quite a few incidents while Bush was in office. Including John Mohammed who was executed last night. The fact is, there are bad people in this world. Doesn't matter who is in office, they will still exist and commit crimes. The fact that we always have to bring religion into it, is what is really disturbing. Most of the time - the people are just plain CRAZY.

jmark
Wednesday Nov 11, 2009 2:50 PM

Bush = an attack by terrorists 234 days (9/11) into his first term. 2,995 dead Americans.

Obama = an attack by a terrorist 289 days (11/5) into his first term. 13 dead Americans.

Team Obama is ahead by 55 days and 2,982 fewer dead Americans.

ajohnson911
Wednesday Nov 11, 2009 3:27 PM

Histroy proves that the 9/11 attack was planned and orchestrated during the Clinton Admin. and only carried out during Bush's term. . . and the perpetrators were brought to justice (the war). By accounts this terrorist has hated America for a long time BUT it is clear his planning and orchestrating the attack is much more recent (and the final straw was his being re-deployed by the obama admin.--who promised to end these wars)--the fault falls to obama.
As further proof, recent stories are suggesting that many more once -quiet "fringe-type" groups are becoming more active and violent ("homegrown" networks)--it cannot be ignored that they choose to act now because an inept president, ill-equipt to deal with real crisis is now in charge.

And CD, please read Amy's post again--you are burying your head in the sand if you do not see that radical islam extremists are the most dangerous element working in the world today--we just don't want to talk about it. If they'll kill over a cartoon, they'll kill for ANY reason--this is NOT TRUE of Christians--something your tag suggests you should understand.

Dustin_Klein
Wednesday Nov 11, 2009 3:54 PM

I think though, that the analysis coming through is the the man quite clearly went insane. This was not an attack on the ideas that America pushes or the ideas that it represents. It is a man who went on a rampage after being driven to madness by only he knows what.

ahemmer
Wednesday Nov 11, 2009 3:57 PM

Christian Democrat: I don't think any Christians think it is OK for Christians to kill in the name of their religion. And when wacko Christians kill abortion doctors, the left is sure to jump on the entire Christian populace, as tho that one lone person represents all. And the press will usually interview the Church, and the Church will denounce the actions of those who murdered. And the killers "Christianity" will be brought up over and over. Now, with radical Islamists, we have a different story. They are killing because of their religion. And the type of religion they practice demands such. Violence and killing - the no-believers must be done away with. Yet, why don't journalists ever interview the leaders in Mosques so they can denounce the radical Islamists? The terrorists? Why don't they like to refer to them as Muslims? Why the heads in the sand? Why so quick to protect one religion - which has a very violent, murderous sect within, versus another?

And the examples of Muslim terrorists within the ranks of the U.S. military that I used from "Jihad's Fifth Column" cannot be called terrorist attacks. Read the descriptions. The only one that even comes close to a "terrorist attack" would have been John Muhammad (the DC sniper - and he's dead now - good riddance). And even then it would be a stretch to say he masterminded a "terrorist attack." He was a sniper. He picked off people one by one in isolated incidents over a period of time. When I think of a "terrorist attack" I think mass casualties all at once. Suicide bombers. 9/11. the attack on the USS Cole and the numerous embassies in other countries - which killed many people at one time. Unless your definition is different, of course.

Jacob Pickard
Wednesday Nov 11, 2009 4:40 PM

Chrisitans who ill abortion doctors are terrorists.
Conservsatives who kill Liberals are terrorists.

Anybody who killes another over religious or poltical ideology is a terrorist.

Christian
Muslim
Right
Left

You can't have it both ways.

referee33
Wednesday Nov 11, 2009 5:05 PM

AJ911: The perpetrators of 9/11 brought justice onto themselves. They also died in the WTC. There is one perpetrator that still needs to be brought to justice, but we can't seem to find him - Osama bin Laden. Nine years, thousands of American soldiers deaths, trillions of dollars later and the "greatest military power in the world" still can't seem to find one lousy guy. Course, that's the fault of the "weak on defense" liberal that took office in January. Whether this was a terrorist attack or simply someone who snapped, it tells us that our military is stressed to the limit and stretched too thin. If this is truly a "war", isn't it time to put the country on a war basis and reinstate the draft?

Jacob Pickard
Wednesday Nov 11, 2009 6:43 PM

Aj - Most of these fringe groups are rightwing milita types.

CurtisXT
Wednesday Nov 11, 2009 10:43 PM

When a Christian kills an abortionist, there are loud and powerful Christian voices who will overtly declare the action to be wrong. Not to mention the multitudes of liberals who will gladly use it to paint all Christians as violent whack-jobs.

So, where are the Muslim leaders decrying the action at Ft. Hood? All we hear are crickets. But why should they speak out when the children in the White house pretending to run this country won't take it seriously. They'll eventually find someone far less divisive to blame, someone who missed the obvious signs. All we know for sure is, the guy who actually killed all those people, he just cracked, it was't his fault. He probably just needed a hug.

Keep ignoring it libs. Keep inventing new terms to minimize what is actually happening. We'll have more "criminal acts" committed by Islamic extremists in our country. And, if you are a liberal and voted for this crowd, don't say this isn't what you expected! This kind of mamby-pamby, don't hurt anyone's feelings, mushy-mouthed, tiptoe language is the talk of the left and the left alone! "Change" "Hope" Uh-huh. If you are a liberal and you don't think this is your language, you better tell someone in charge, because they represent you. That broad brush paints both ways.

ajohnson911
Wednesday Nov 11, 2009 10:56 PM

Ref--so, you would count the terrorists among the dead of September 11th, 2001? You place their miserable lives as equal to the men, women and children who died in the towers? And you next elevate Bin Laden as some super villian evading "the greatest military power in history"--effectively mocking our soldiers. And it's Veteran's Day!!!! And you further ignore this terrorists fundamentalist ties and lump all American service members as "stretched to the limit" effectively saying that they are all about to "snap." THAT IS WHAT YOU JUST WROTE!!!

Please explain yourself if I have those facts wrong?

Folks! Referee33 is a traitor and an enemy sympathizer--there can be NO question about it when you read his post above.

Man, I would love to meet you some day--we could go out for some punch--just for kicks!!!!

ajohnson911
Wednesday Nov 11, 2009 11:02 PM

No jacob, the real threat in America today is from ISLAM!!!

And old as I am, if they continue to bring their terrorism cloaked in religion to this country I won't wait for a draft--I
l'll be waiting at my door with my God and my guns!!!!

jhayett
Thursday Nov 12, 2009 7:59 AM

Amy...maybe this is why we can't use the word "terrorist" or "Islam fundamentalists."

http://www.youtube.com/watch_popup?v=tCAffMSWSzY

jhayett
Thursday Nov 12, 2009 8:02 AM

ajohnson911...thanks for reminding me to read ref33's post. I can't believe he wrote that. But I guess the real liberal hate for this country got him too.

ahemmer
Thursday Nov 12, 2009 8:10 AM

CurtisXT: Excellent point. When a Christian nut job commits a henious act, like murdering an abortion doctor because they are against killing babies, the liberals are quick to go nuts and condemn all Christians. No matter that the majority of Christians out there speak out AGAINST the terrible crime.
However, when an Islamic jihadist murders innocent people at Ft. Hood, the entire Muslim community remains silent. And our mainstream media doesn't even bother to go to Mosques to get a viewpoint. I bet they are afraid that they will not get a condemnation of such acts. And they wouldn't want to print that, now, would they? After all, Islam is a religion of peace.....even though some aspects of Islam as interpreted by a radical sect DEMAND killing and violence of non-believers. President Obama was dead wrong when he declared in his wimpy speech at Ft. Hood " "No faith justifies these murderous and craven acts." Yes, Mr. Obama - one faith DOES - the radical faction of Islam. Study what Islam calls "Shariah" and you will understand this.

jmark
Thursday Nov 12, 2009 8:12 AM

Obama is to blame for the Fort Hood killings. You know, because it happened on his watch.

Clinton is to blame for 9/11. You know, because the idea of attacking the US originated during his presidency. It would follow that any plans being hatched today for an attack on the US can be attributed to Obama's "weak on defense" administration.

Ref is a "traitor and an enemy sympathizer". You know, because he dared mention the fact that Bin Laden is still at large ... on Veteran's Day (isn't Ref a veteran?) no less!!! The nerve!

Soldier, turn in your dog tags!

Folks, what we are witnessing is the twisted, perverted logic of a religious extremist. Keep you children away from this demented man-child. He is armed and dangerous.

2Cents
Thursday Nov 12, 2009 8:22 AM

Jake - "Chrisitans who ill abortion doctors are terrorists." - "Anybody who killes another over religious or poltical ideology is a terrorist."

I am not aware of any group (Christian or otherwise) who preaches killing abortion doctors, do you? When one man seeks out another man and kills him, it's murder.

When anyone seeks out person(s) to kill under the ideology of a terrorist group, is a terrorist.

So to you Jake, and the others who persistently try to spin this terrorist subject, I ask you this . . . AGAIN!

Is the "world-wide" problem with terrorism a Muslim Extremist problem or these "lone wolf" individuals influenced by rogue ideologies?

What single extremist group has terrorized every continent on planet earth? What other group has established itself in most every country in the world? What other extremist group has a pool of 1.4 billion members to recruit from?

Should we be concerned about the home-grown terrorists, of coarse. Not all Muslims are terrorist, but the Radical Muslim population is undeniably the biggest terrorist threat to mankind.

jhayett
Thursday Nov 12, 2009 8:24 AM

jmark...what we are witnessing is your liberal lack of reading and defining what ones write. Yes, ajohnson has a point if you can read between Ref's lines.

jmark
Thursday Nov 12, 2009 11:22 AM

jim, I see space between Ref's lines ... no doubt similar to the space between your ears. Perhaps you could interpret for me?

Dustin_Klein
Thursday Nov 12, 2009 11:37 AM

When muslims kill in the name of religion there are also those who will vocalize it's wrongdoing. When christians kill abortion doctors there are those who will also do the same. This isn't a matter of whether or not we should be thinking it was some terrorist act from an entire religion, it is a small act that we faced in the United States.

What about the men and women that die every day in Iraq from roadside bombs?

ahemmer
Thursday Nov 12, 2009 12:46 PM

Dustin Klein: Brush the sand out of your eyes. A radical Muslim U.S. army officer, Major Nadal Malik Hasan, shouted "Allahu Akbar!" prior to killing 13 people. (Turns out now that one of them was pregnant, too. The victim rate should go up to 14 - if a fetus is considered a human being. I know some people refuse to believe that.) This was a terrorist act. Hasan posted anti-American hate-speech on his website. He praised suicide bombers. He followed Shariah law - violence and killing are demanded! No matter how libs and the Prez try to sugarcoat this one, most of us with common sense and a brain realize Hasan was NOT insane, but a radical Islamist terrorist. He was following and practicing his violent aspect of the Islamic religion. That aspect demands that non-believers be killed. Try as you want to dismiss that, you cannot if you examine the facts with an open mind. Not everyone who kills is insane. If so, why are there ANY murderes currently in prison or on death row? Shouldn't they all be in the nut house? Hasan is being touted as a hero to Islamic terrorists abroad.
And it is attitudes like yours, and President Obama's, and the news media, - the attitude that refuses to put blame on a violent religion and terrorists - that will set the stage for more such terrorist attacks in the future. By refusing to admit there is a problem - radical homegrown Muslims in the U.S. military - we are aiding the enemy via political correctness and ignorance. Evil exists, Mr. Klein. No matter how much you hum Kumbaya and hold hands, lighting candles and giving peace signs.

ajohnson911
Thursday Nov 12, 2009 12:52 PM

Gee, Dustin, did Christians plant those bombs in the streets of Baghdad? And believe me, I'm not above calling Americans out too--It's akin to the violence in Milwaukee--a broken culture with broken values having no regard for human life.

Hey ref--where are you? Are you going to explain yorself? At least be confident that you have another traitor/enemy sympathizer in jmark.

referee33
Thursday Nov 12, 2009 11:19 PM

ajohnson911: Sorry about not responding immediately to your comments. I was busy today corrupting my grandsons 1st grade class with lessons about phonics and math. I volunteer as an instructional aide two days a week at his school. So I was out of touch until now. First question I need to ask is to the moderator of this site. What are the guidelines that you follow in allowing comments to be published? I believe that ajohnson911 has threatened me with physical violence and you have approved that. AJ, meeting you for "punch" and "kicks" goes against my teachings, but my baser nature would welcome it.
You stated that the perpetrators of 9/11 were brought to justice by the war. You are wrong. The actual perpetrators died in the attack on the WTC. They were not brought to justice by any effort of the US government. The only person that needs to be brought to justice is Osama bin Laden, and he has not been captured in over eight years, that is a fact. The US has a military budget that is greater that the rest of the world combined, we have 761 bases around the world, and we can't find one person, that's pathetic.
I served four years during Vietnam, don't you dare call me a traitor. I've been spit on as a vet, and been called a baby killer and worse. Show me your "bona fides" and maybe I'll listen to your rants!

ajohnson911
Friday Nov 13, 2009 10:59 AM

Ref--I thought we just moved the 9/11 plotters from gitmo to NY? It's not the justice I'd want, (another bad decision by obama) but it would seem that "justice" will be served--at least there will be a trial? And interestingly enough, you say osama is the ONLY person needing to be brought to justice? Really?

(By the way--I say he's dead!!!) (A kim jong-ill charade).

I'm sorry for you though, your past service is admirable, (and I love our Vets.--ONLY liberals call Vietnam era soldiers, or any other soldiers, baby killer or spit on them!!!) but I question now (today) your allegiance to this country--for the many excellent reasons I pointed out above!!!

It's sad, your life experiences and your views are in opposition; you've been twisted and poisoned somehow. I wish you better days and truer vision.

referee33
Friday Nov 13, 2009 12:06 PM

AJ: Only was a poor word choice on my part. I also believe he is dead, but I doubt that we will ever have proof of that.
I fail to see why you question my allegiance. Is it because I dare question what I think is an illegal war? Isn't that my right? Is it because I believe in the equality of all men, even terrorists, in line with the thinking of the writers of the Declaration of Independence? Is it because I believe that, yes I am my brothers keeper, and do have a social conscience?
I also wish you better days and the removal of the beam in your eye.

ajohnson911
Friday Nov 13, 2009 3:21 PM

My response was lost--who knows, maybe it will show up later?

Ref--let's talk here. . .

I note that you believe osama is the "only" one needing justice? Really? So, not the 5 guys being moved from gitmo to NY--a TERRIBLE idea by the way (another obama mistake)! I guess our military failed in catching and detaining them? I really can't believe you're beating that drum!

***By the way. . .I think osama is dead--they're playing a kim-jong-ill charade with us. If he's not dead--he's deactivated for sure (thanks troops) and holed up somewhere like the snake he is.***

I'm sad for you though; What happened?--your experiences and your beliefs are opposite?

I appreciate your service and hold our Vets. in the highest regard--thank you. Man, it's the liberals who call you baby killer and spit on you though-- and I wonder how its twisted and poisoned your views today. Yes, I question your allegiances to this country TODAY by what you've written--for the excellent reasons I've stated it's a reasonable charge to make, I think.

More than anybody, YOU should support our troops because you've been there; you know what they do, how they suffer; what they give up to protect us. People our lumping this Fort Hood Islamic Terrorist in with our other troops--the military is causing people to go mad--no, he's a terrorist. And you earlier included the plane hijackers with the innocent Amer. who died on Sept. 11th?? How can you?

Ref--my bona fides are joining the fire service/ems after the attacks that killed so many of the many I now call my brothers. I give to Vet. organizations, send baskets, etc to groups that support YOUR "brothers in arms."

I don't know. . .please explain it to me?

I would like to meet you, really-but, you're right, let's meet as friends.

I hope this one goes through!!!

referee33
Friday Nov 13, 2009 10:40 PM

AJ: Your response did go through and I replied to it. Yes, Maj. Hasan is probably a terrorist, but who can tell what led him down that path. Was it strictly religion or did stress play a part as well? Look at how many returning vets are committing suicide. Our military is being pushed to the breaking point because ever since the start of this
"war", it has only been the military carrying the load. After the attack on the WTC, what did Pres. Bush tell the American people to do - go shop. Where were the bond drives of WWII, gas rationing to send more fuel to the troops, a draft to increase the number of troops in order to decrease the length of time spent in theater?
I include the hijackers in the total of victims because they are also God's creatures. I believe they are victims of a sort as well. Victims of an ideology that has twisted the basic premise of their religion. Much like the Christians twisted their beliefs to justify the Crusades.
Bringing the accused to NY for trial is the correct procedure. In my view, war, is between sovereign countries. The terrorist attacks in the US are not being carried out by representatives of sovereign nations, but by individuals acting without government authority, they are criminals, and need to be treated as such.
I appreciate the "quiet" response and hope to continue our discussion in this manner. I really feel crappy when I lose my cool and respond adversarialy.

2Cents
Saturday Nov 14, 2009 10:07 AM

@ Ref & AJ . . . bravo!

True debate without the discussing name calling and hatred that infest this blog site.

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